Suzanne Chadwick 0:00
Hey, friend, Hey, how are you? Welcome back to another week. I hope that you are amazing and fantabulous and all things. Just you know, wonderful. Oh, hope so excited to have you here. And we have got such a good episode for you today. I love the title as well, how to create a message that hits your audience in the fields, people in the fields. And I got one of my lovely, lovely clients. Kate Merriweather, let me tell you a little bit about her, she actually came to our speaker, House Speaker and thought leaders retreat a little while ago, and it was so good to spend time with her. And I just think she's a little bit of a Word, Word Wizard. And so Kate is a red headed LinkedIn coach who believes that LinkedIn can be a money making powerhouse. If you have the right strategy, she creates custom LinkedIn strategies to help her clients effortlessly attract inbound leads with 0% Hustle by sharing bold content that turns fans into followers and followers into buyers. Can you tell she used to be a copywriter and obviously uses those skills today to help her clients. And I loved this chat, like it was super fun. So I think you're gonna really enjoy it. But also the topic that we're talking about, because this was something she said, she sees all the time that people are struggling with. And so we wanted to talk about it on the podcast is how to create a message and the content that really does hit your audience in the fields. And she's gonna give you three or some questions that you can start asking yourself and your clients to create content that makes your clients go, Oh my gosh, are you talking to me. And so you definitely want to be listening in on this episode. So I am super excited to have her on. I love this chat. Just a reminder as well, that obviously we've got magnetic mastery coming up, Kate is coming along to that and the bold Christmas party on the 23rd of November. So make sure you head to Sue's chadwick.com, forward slash m m for magnetic mastery. Spend the day on you, yourself your business, really understand what makes you magically magnetic. And we are going to be working on creating that bold message that you want to take to the world in 2023. And learning to trust yourself to make those bold decisions in your business as well. So make sure you grab your tickets come along come Boogie with us in the evening, celebrate the year that was can't wait. You're gonna be there or you're going to be there. Don't wait get in, grab your ticket get out from behind the desk. Let's do this. So without further ado, let's dive into this week's episode. Kate, welcome to the brandbuilders Lab podcast.

Kate Merryweather 3:27
Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here. I've been listening to this podcast for a long time. One day I'm gonna be on this podcast. Sorry. And yeah. You need to actually release it because it'd be awkward if you aka Yeah, did it and then Oh, no. didn't make it.

Suzanne Chadwick 3:52
Oh my gosh, that makes me love so much, of course will relate. Of course. So Kate, for my audience who don't know you? Who are Yeah.

Kate Merryweather 4:05
Oh, it's okay. Sure. So I am a LinkedIn coach, I help people grow their business with LinkedIn. And before that I was a copywriter. So I've spent a lot of years crafting messages for my clients and myself. And I really want to encourage more women to just get more visible. So LinkedIn is fine. But I think we all have like a bigger goal and particularly women my age who maybe feel like they need to be invisible or feel a bit self conscious. I'd love to see those women show that 25k Oh, yes.

Suzanne Chadwick 4:45
I love it. women my age. We're in what BIAs are we ticking on?

Kate Merryweather 4:49
46 But I do sometimes lie and say I'm older. You lie and say you're older. Because then everyone's like where are you great for 55

Suzanne Chadwick 5:00
I don't think I've ever heard anybody say they lie that they're older. I've been doing that for years. I love it. That's hilarious. So that's the quirkiness that I love about you. That's so good. So why LinkedIn? Like, why did you make the switch? So you were doing copy decided, and then you wanted to be a LinkedIn coach. And I have to say, you are probably the one person that is just like, prolific with your videos on LinkedIn is so consistent. And I see them all the time. What made you I've got a couple of questions for you what made you shift from just copywriting to LinkedIn? Number one.

Kate Merryweather 5:41
I had been a copywriter for 10 years, and I was just ready for something new. And, and I think maybe you said this, Suze, but I picked up in my brain, it's better to exchange your opinion for money then your time. And with copywriting, I was spending a lot of time writing content up in the hours. And if something took me longer than I expected, because I wasn't feeling that creative flow that day, then I didn't necessarily, you know, the fee was the fee. And it was just more time. So I was really exchanging time for money. Yeah. And I think to after 10 years, I felt like I'd achieved a lot. And I was just ready to do something new. And I was already using LinkedIn to promote myself as a copywriter and been very successful. And I was getting all of my leads on LinkedIn. And everyone just kept asking me about how amusingly Dean, how do you do videos? How do you how do you manage to get so visible on LinkedIn? How did you grow your audience? And then I just had this moment, like, Oh, I think I can, I think I can help people with this. It took me a bit of a while to work it out. And I tried a few other things, which didn't quite land. But once I had that moment of art, I think I can I can help people with LinkedIn. And, and that was only a few months ago, it was only in June that I took that plunge.

Suzanne Chadwick 7:02
Yeah, but I love that I love that you listen to your audience, and you became really good at doing something even though that wasn't what you were helping others to do. And then it just was a natural progression to do that as well. And I think just following your intuition and listening to your audience, and also just kind of feeling like you are over that and ready for something new. That does seem like such an obvious thing. Because I have to say that when I think of LinkedIn, I do think of you know,

Kate Merryweather 7:30
that's lovely. And, you know, I was interviewing a career coach, and she, I was writing a blog for her. And she said, people change their career on average, every seven years. And I I took that is a sign and saying, Well, I'm overdue, because I had been nine years at that time. And that to me was like, you've been doing this for too long, do something new. I don't know, that is not what she meant at all when she said it, but that's how I took it. And then I just had a bit of a fire, I find something else to do, because I just stopped loving it. And that's not a good place to be for your clients. I don't want to write content for clients, and I'm not enjoying and they deserve better. And there's lots of data copywriters out there that can, you know, take on clients. Yeah. And I gave all my clients away.

Suzanne Chadwick 8:16
Yeah, that's Yeah, that's so good. And I also think like, even, you know, the change your career, I think, just evolve. Like, even for me, I'm currently doing my life coaching certification. And I'm still a business coach, but I'm just like, the evolution of who you are, and, you know, learning new skills and doing new things. I just think I don't think that we can say stagnant for too long. I just don't think that's how we are. And if and if we are, then you know what I think about people that have been in their careers forever and done exactly the same thing. That's not what lights them up anyway. Like, there's maybe like, that's just their, that's what they do. Absolutely not what they enjoy. But I think that a lot of us what we do is what we enjoy, and so we always want to kind of be making that better as well.

Kate Merryweather 9:02
Absolutely. So new adventures await.

Suzanne Chadwick 9:06
Love it. So, so good. And so today, we are going to be talking about how to create a message that hits your audience in the fields, which I love. And so why are we talking about this case? Why do you think this is important for us to think about? And no,

Kate Merryweather 9:22
I see this mistake a lot. I see people putting out content that doesn't get the audience in the field in the fields. So I feel it's a very common mistake. And when I work with my clients, I see them they often say, Oh, I'm doing all the things, but it's not working. And this is the missing piece of the puzzle that they haven't looked at. They're making assumptions about how the audience feels, or potentially getting it wrong, or they haven't thought about it at all. And so they're putting a lot of content out thinking that they're doing all the right things, but the messaging doesn't land and that That's the difference between success on any platform, not just LinkedIn, anywhere in any way that you're showing up in business. If your messaging is right, the rest becomes much easier.

Suzanne Chadwick 10:10
And so when a message hits your audience in the fields, what happens?

Kate Merryweather 10:16
Well, they start to trust you, I want to think about what do you want the audience to think? Or say to themselves, when they read your content? You want to ask them a question. And they go, yes, yes, that's me. Or think, you know, are you struggling with this problem, and I think that's me. And then once they think those things, and have those feelings, and have that emotional connection, then they trust, I think this person gets me, this person is speaking to me. I had someone messaged me on Facebook saying, oh, what you wrote, were you bugging my house, because I was saying this the other day. So you want them to have that reaction to think, wow, this person really understands what I'm going through, and the emotions that I'm feeling. And then once they think that, then they they're going to start following you and seeing what else you have to say. And then you can nurture them, you can get them on your list, you can ask them to keep following you. And then hopefully, eventually, they'll buy from you because you've established that trust.

Suzanne Chadwick 11:17
Yeah, I love that. And I do I love it when, when I you know, a podcast comes out or something. And somebody's like, once again, reading my mind, like, were you were you in my brain. And I think that's such a great, great way for your audience to feel. And I feel like that sometimes, like when I listen to a podcast, I'm like, Oh, my God, I so wanted to know that. Like, I've been thinking about that. And so the question is, how do we do it?

Kate Merryweather 11:42
So those three questions, I like to sit myself down and put myself in the mind of my audience, or I help my clients, I'll go through this with them. And the first one is, I want to set a goal, what do they want? And quite often, when I speak to my clients, they might say, Oh, they want this dismiss. And I'll say, how do you know they want that? And they haven't really done the work to ask. So. I have my clients say, I want to make money on LinkedIn, I want to get leads on LinkedIn. And then, and they might say, but I don't think my audience is on LinkedIn. And I say, What do you know? How do you know? So it's important to ask your audience the questions like do some market research, and ask them what their goals are. And

Suzanne Chadwick 12:27
I feel like the word market research or the phrase scares people. Yeah, just like doctors that that sounds very big. And it sounds very formal. But what how can we interpret that in like layman's terms?

Kate Merryweather 12:41
Yes. So what did they do? Yeah, there's obviously you can go through the big formal Road, like you can create a survey and send everyone questions. But I think a bit of social stalking is actually really helpful. And I saw someone put a question up about how does people feel about LinkedIn, and then I read all the comments, and I was like, here's all my content for next week. Because people are saying, I don't like it, I feel scared of it. I think it's lame, I hate it. I can touch base on all those feelings in my content. So using some social stalking is fantastic, too. And the other important thing is to use the language that that they use. So if they say I hate it, don't say despise, say hate, like use the language that your audience is using in your messaging. People tend to maybe make it more sophisticated or change it around a bit. But I think it's really important even word for word, the way that they talk is the way that you should talk.

Suzanne Chadwick 13:42
Yeah, bit of a Batum is always good. So just coming back to the social stalking, so who were you socially stalking.

Kate Merryweather 13:50
I just jumped in Facebook groups, mostly. And I'm in I'm stalking people to see how they feel about LinkedIn. So your area of expertise, you could jump in and set you know, goals or whatever it might be. Yeah, search the group by topic. And the other thing you could do is you can ask yourself, ask them, Hey, how do you feel about x? How do you feel about whatever it might be? And people will come back with really interesting comments that maybe aren't quite what you imagined people feel. Because there's a process where when it's once your paying customer comes to you, they're in a different mindset to someone who's your pre customer who's still struggling with all this stuff and not ready to buy so they're the ones that you talk to. So if you're getting all your goals, fears and problems from your paying clients, that's slightly different from when they're pre customer stage where they're just thinking about it. So that's where your social stalking can come in. But I think I only mentioned one question but I've got two others you've got your goals I want to and your fears, so I'm afraid so people You might say I'm afraid of showing up. I'm afraid of making video, I'm afraid of looking silly, things like that. So you can talk to that fear. Because fear drives a lot of decision making. If you understand your audience's fears, and you can, hopefully build up their confidence to help them address some of those fears, then they will really trust you. So thinking about that, I'm afraid and finishing the sentence for your audience.

Suzanne Chadwick 15:30
Can I just ask a question? Can I go back a second? And just ask a question. When you were talking about the way that your customer talks about the problem is different to the way that somebody who has not yet bought talks about the problem? What's the difference?

Kate Merryweather 15:49
Well, I think once they've made that purchasing decision, they're your customer. And you usually get a lot of insights from them. But you kind of want to rewind back to when they're, if you're wanting to attract new customers into your world, what were they thinking before they bought? Sometimes it's a little bit different. They haven't got that trust, yet. They haven't got those fears yet. So maybe just thinking about the process. It goes from maybe discovering you to buying from you. And maybe they'll think oh, yeah, I never thought about that, like people send me I never thought about LinkedIn until you started crapping on about it. And then, so my content needs to encourage people to think about LinkedIn in different ways. The people who then buy are like, Yes, I'm on board. You've persuaded me, I get it now. So they're in a different stage of the buying journey. So yeah, just I just be careful of just surveying your paying customers to get the answers to these questions, because it's the customers who haven't yet bought that have a slightly different perspective sometimes. And so you want to include them in your research as well.

Suzanne Chadwick 16:52
Yeah, I love that. And it's kind of that problem unaware problem aware? Yes, solution aware solution unaware. And so just for my audience who may not know that framework as a copywriter, can you just quickly give us a little bit on that one? Because I think that's I think it's a really good framework actually just like to prompt you to think about if somebody has no idea what the problem is, what are the what's the pain that they're feeling? And so those those different?

Kate Merryweather 17:20
Yeah, exactly. So usually, like you don't know that you have a problem is the start. And then so then your education content might be around, hey, this is a problem, you know, you need to make them aware. Or then the next stage is you do know that you have a problem, but you don't know what to do about it. So you have to understand that you have a you have an issue, maybe say it is the fitness analogy. So the first one is you don't know that you're not fit. And then you hurt yourself. And then your physio tells you your neck is really weak. And then you're like, oh, no, I need to get stronger neck. So then you might be like, well, how then you have a lack of solution awareness. So you know, you've got the problem, but you don't know what the solution is. So then you might be shopping around for physios, or fitness or neck massages, all sorts of things, not knowing what your solution is. And then you become solution aware, which is I know, I have a problem. And I know what the solution is as well. So any copywriting strategy will take the audience through that to educate them, point them towards taking an action, potentially buying hopefully, if you're a good copywriter.

 

Suzanne Chadwick 18:34
So good. That's so good. I love that. And so coming back to I'm afraid of Yes. And so how else can we understand what their fears are?

Kate Merryweather 18:46
I think it's a bit more difficult because people can be a bit cagey about their fears. So I think social stalking is still good there. But you know, when you say on Facebook, people go, what's your challenge? And they want people to answer like, that's really private. So it can be a bit difficult for you to how could you frame everyone tell me your problems? Just lay it all out on the table? Yeah. And they don't. So I think that does take a bit of ingenuity

Suzanne Chadwick 19:23
and moral listening thing, like sometimes I think like people may not write it down. But when I listen to people speak, whether it's you know, whether it's clients or whether it's people at events, or whatever it is, it's just kind of listening for some of that. Yeah, like,

Kate Merryweather 19:42
I think we've that give people options. So you would say what, what most bothers you about x x y Zed and give them you know, say five and then see what they choose rather than saying What's your biggest fear? Yeah, because that open ended question is challenging for people. No answer. Just be careful. We asking people, I had one woman in my DMs going, what's your biggest challenge in your business? And I was like, I don't know you. I don't want to tell you. I don't want to tell you. Yeah, there has to be a bit of trust there as well. And I think if you're good at what you do, you should have a good instinct anyway, as to what you know, like, I know what people say to me and what they struggle with think I just can't be consistent. That's a big thing that people struggle with. So I talk about that a lot, and how they can solve that problem.

Suzanne Chadwick 20:30
Yeah. And we'll go on to the third question. Yeah. How do you record all of this? Where is all of this in your? Like, how do you track it?

Kate Merryweather 20:39
I just have a little spreadsheet. And I have all the I want to, and I'll list maybe 10 on I'm afraid, maybe 10 or so or as many as you can get? And every quarter also, I'll update them. Because things change. Yeah. Particularly MySpace like, LinkedIn is releasing all these new things. So I need to, you know, people might have a new problem is they don't know whether they should have it news newsletter on LinkedIn, short answer, no, don't worry. So your goals and problems might change as the industry changes or things like that might be fairly static. But you'll know, you'll know. I think most clients can answer this. Well, if they're good at what they do, they have a good instinct. However, sometimes they get it wrong, which is why it's important to just question Why do you think that like, can you prove it? Like I had one guy say to me, my audiences and on LinkedIn, I'm like, How do you know you're just guessing that's, that's where it can get dangerous?

Suzanne Chadwick 21:44
And making all of those assumptions as well. And so how would he test that? Is he asking his audience? Is he using LinkedIn and seeing the response like?

Kate Merryweather 21:55
Well, even on LinkedIn, you can just go if you say your audiences, chiropractors, you can jump on and see how many other how many people with the job title are on there. Lots is usually the answer. Some of them may or may not be active, which is another thing. But I think it's important to always ask, you can also I see a lot of people doing it in their newsletters, which is really great. It's a good way to tag people as well. Like, you can say, Are you this? Or are you that and people will respond, just click a button. And you can find out quite easily. If you have a newsletter audience, it's a good thing to do to just use that audience. They're an engaged audience, ask them some questions every so often.

Suzanne Chadwick 22:36
Yeah, yeah, I love that. And I've shared before, like, I like to do like a three, like to ask three questions every now and again, just get people to share what it is that they what's going on with them. And I find that I do find that email surveys or questions in emails work because it's private. Exactly. Because they're just letting if they want to, they're just letting you know.

Kate Merryweather 23:00
I'm well keen on surveys, I'd love to do them. I always fit fill out surveys, because I'm interested in what people are asking. Yeah, yes, I used to work in PR. And we used to do surveys all the time, to get media out of it. So that's the other thing you can do with you do if you do a survey, you can release it, release the results.

Suzanne Chadwick 23:20
And I also think don't assume that your audience don't want to answer a survey, I had a client that was like, Who wants to answer a survey? I'm like, okay, sponsors. Well, Kate, for why, but I get responses all the time. And then she did it. And she got loads of responses that I'm just like, don't assume, like, I just think there's a couple of things that are true. People love to talk about themselves, and people love to give their opinions and surveys allow them to do both those things. I think that if there's if there's trust there, then I think that, you know, your audience is always more than happy to share what's going on with them. If you're signed up for you know, your emails, and that there's obviously a relationship there. So why not give it a go? If you've not done it already?

Kate Merryweather 24:03
Yeah. And you can always incentivize them, you can say, well, who fills out the survey can win an hour of your time or prize or something like that?

Suzanne Chadwick 24:14
Well, I just did. If you if you fill out the survey, and you left your email address, then I just did like a live one hour talking through the feedback and what people were dealing with and some ideas to get them like unstuck from some of the problems that we were seeing. And we also filtered it by like, is this your side hustle? Are you 123 years in business? Are you like three years plus, and went through like that, and I get the feedback on that was great. And I think it's just re engaging your audience again as well plus getting all of this great information. Fantastic. So good. What's the third question?

Kate Merryweather 24:53
So the third question is around a problem so I don't know how so what do they not know how to do? It? So they're problem aware, but they do. So in your cases, you might say, but I want to move forward, I want to take my business to the next level, but I don't know how to step up or something like that. So if they if you see that phrase step up, then you can use that time to step up, you know, use that phrase. When I did my survey, someone said, I really need like a roadmap. And I was like, Oh, I can start, I can start talking about a roadmap, or my husband said, Well, that's a very corporate term. They give you this, these phrases that are so powerful for you to use. And that's where you can then get it back to hitting them in the fields. If you say, Do you not know how to step up or show up? Or whatever those terms are, then that's when they connect with you. Whereas if you're saying, Are you struggling to facilitate outcomes, that's not gonna get them. And then they tap out. Like, I had a client who was a coach working with women, and she was talking about women who were feeling rage. And she was using this quite strong language. And I said, that's, that's a term that I don't resonate with as a parent that I'm that I'm feeling rage, maybe, either I'm not the right person, you want to work, but you thought, and I just encouraged her to really think about that term rage, and whether that was right for her. And she went back and did some research and just up did some listening. And she realized that people were tapping out because she was talking about rage. And they didn't identify with rage, but they felt like losing their temper snapping at their kids. So she was able to modify her language. And then her audience was more connected with what she was saying, because soon as she talked about, you know, do you feel uncontrollable rage? They didn't identify with that at all. And they would say, No, no, I don't. So then they tap out. So that's frustration and noise. Yes, yeah. Yeah. Do you ever snap at your kids? Hell yeah. You know, me too.

Suzanne Chadwick 27:02
I'm so I've got a question for you on that. Because I think sometimes I find it really interesting that certain phrases, and words become very popular. But a lot of times, not a lot of times, but sometimes they feel generic. So one of the things that I don't, I'm not, I don't love is like, take your power back. Or even things like, like step up, or, and I feel like I have used it in the past. But it kind of is something that people might use. But from a copy perspective, and from a messaging perspective, it's so common in the market, that it almost loses any kind of differentiation, authenticity, uniqueness, because it's so common. So how do you kind of, you know, use your clients language, but make sure it's not what everybody else is using to

Kate Merryweather 28:01
that's really important that you bring that up, because it is a common problem. And it's just about that's when a copywriter can be great to just massage a message into a different way. So a lot of coaches talk about being stuck. And everyone's talking about getting unstuck, or like dealing with blocks or limiting beliefs. And if everyone's talking about it, then it might be accurate, but it's not going to help you stand out. And that feeling stuck is just a bit too vague.

Suzanne Chadwick 28:36
So isn't that interesting? Because that's the language that a lot of clients use. Like a lot of my audience use that where they're just like, I'm stuck. I don't know what to do now. Like, I'm not sure what the next step is. And so that's what I mean, between the balancing Yes, listening, but but phrases becoming common and people adopting language that they feel reflects where they are, but like you said, it kind of loses its impact when everybody's using the same terms.

Kate Merryweather 29:06
Yes, yes. So I think you just need to pick another term, that means the same thing, but also, I think, as a great opportunity to own own a phrase that people associate with you. Like I talk about faux Sue, if you're showing up. And I just everyone's talking about showing up, but I turn it into faux Sue, because that's a little bit more unique to me. So you can take that phrase, and turn it into your own somehow do a bit of tweaking. But if you're one thing I would, I would always say is, and I said this when I was writing blogs to people, if your competitor could put their name at the bottom of that blog article, and it made perfect sense that it's a bad blog article, because it hasn't got enough personality and uniqueness to you. And I think that's where we're stumbling around on this ease. You need to have that unique content. I hate the word unique, but content that someone else couldn't lift and copy, because you can see, you can be scrolling through and you reading the content without knowing who it's from. And then you think it's from someone edits from someone else, because they're also similar. So that's when crafting some messaging that's unique to you that talks about your particular framework, or what are the stuff that you can create that no one else can talk about? Because it's your intellectual property, like a particular philosophy, or like a categorize? What's her name, Gretchen Rubin, she does the four tendencies, like she created this four types of people. And she created a huge asset out of it. So maybe you could create four types of people that struggle with different problems, and you can start talking to them. That way, you'll be the only one talking about it, everyone else is talking about stuck. But you're talking about the five different types of stuck, you know, or whatever it might be just taking it to more depth, more insight, and therefore more connection. And they've all had the Oh, are you feeling stuck, I can help you deal with those blocks?

Suzanne Chadwick 31:18
And do you feel like creating really unique and identifiable content requires strong opinions?

Kate Merryweather 31:27
Not necessarily, it helps. If you're naturally a bit contrary, if you're naturally the kind to say, this is a bad idea. And you know, I don't care what anyone thinks. But I'm here to tell you that Instagram sucks or whatever. I think if it's authentic to you as a person, and you like being a bit of a rabble rouser, then go for it. But there's a lot of people who don't want to occupy that space for whatever reason. And I wouldn't want to suggest that they do just to get attention, that it has to be authentic to you. Because if you create this persona of someone who just grabs attention, and it's not really who you are, then when people start to work with you, they're going to feel a disconnect. So the more that you can show up as yourself as your genuine selves, the easier it is, yes, you can get attention online by being crazy or can't, you know, offering a different view, and you can get a lot of attention that way. But yeah, it's not authentic to you, then. It doesn't last. Yeah. And you get, you know, people will come for you. Okay, love the fight, you know, and that's their life, and they do really well. But most people don't want to be like that, if you know, if I just want to celebrate, you know, like, I'm not like that I want to sell I talk about a few things. I think, hey, this doesn't work, whatever. But you know, you can do it in a generous way, in a gentle way. You don't have to, like Kang shoot on everyone else. Or

Suzanne Chadwick 33:07
I also think that it's okay. When somebody disagrees with you. I was talking about this a while ago. And I'm just like, even if you've got an opinion, where even if it's not extreme, yeah, he disagrees with you. It's like, thanks so much for sharing your view. Like, it's totally fine. You don't, I think something that some of my audience has said to me, is I'm scared that if I say this, or if I, especially in the health and wellness space, like people are very opinionated a lot of the time and they're like, I feel like if I say what I think and I believe that somebody's going to come for me who has got a different opinion. And I was like, and how is that a problem? Like if they if they have a go? It's just about how you decide to receive it as well. It's just like, Thanks for your opinion. You know, the great thing is that we can all have different opinions. Yeah. And come at it from different angles.

Kate Merryweather 33:56
I think with that, you can think well, am I willing to defend myself if someone has a crack? Yes. Personal Yeah. I don't you know, what, about or something like that? Or am I willing to be open to new ways of thinking go? Like, I've had people comment on something I've written and LinkedIn, blah, blah, blah. And so we're gonna say, hey, what about this guy? Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, thanks. Yeah, I don't think that makes me look silly, or it makes me look open. So if you're either willing to defend your viewpoint, if someone is aggro at you or willing to be open to someone going, hey, you know, have you thought of? No, actually, that's really great. Like, I remember someone I was talking about LinkedIn company pages and saying how they rubbish. And this girl who's like an expert in LinkedIn company pages was like, hang on a minute, blah, blah. And I was like, Okay, you got me like, she made some points that I wasn't aware of. And it was all fine. She defended her view. I defended mine. And she thought she schooled me like she taught me some stuff I didn't know

Suzanne Chadwick 35:00
Just go with me. So good. I've got a question for you as well. So when it comes to hitting our audience in the fields, and writing content, what's your thought on tips versus thought leadership?

Kate Merryweather 35:15
Well, your thought leadership is about getting people to think in a different way. So maybe opening their eyes. So if you're talking about them not being aware of their problems, then that can be really useful to them. A tip stuff. I mean, I like a lot of tips, because people love to follow tips, but they don't engage with tips. But the problem with tips is that everyone's sharing tips. Yes. So I like to have a mix of both. So you're giving people lots of value. But you do need to amplify that and think, I think one of the things people go, Oh, this is really important. And then it's there. But why question are so what questions so like, I think a lot of people give the why something is important, but not the how. So if your audience is asking that, get reading that and going, this really matters, and then they think your audience is thinking, asking, but how do I do it, then that's poor content. So that's where the thought leadership would come in to go. This is what matters. And this is how to get started, like, just give people more hell, and not just the wire. So the how is, is the tips. But the why is the thought leadership like, you know, if you like, if you're afraid to show up, then think of it this way. Think of it as serving your audience. Rather than putting yourself out there. Your blog, people that you don't want to see you or think of the fact that you have a small audience is an advantage, because not many people will see you, as you grow, you'll get better, you have a bigger audience. And you can see yourself as it's a benefit to have a small audience when you're starting out, because that's when you'll be a little bit clunky and things like that. So you can twist the way people think. But I still think value is good, because people do want value and want to follow value. And yeah, one free helpful tips. You just can't have that alone. And if everyone's sharing tips, like, hey, use these hashtags, or whatever it might be, then I think it's always important to think about what the rest of the industry is saying, If everyone's doing tips and tricks. That that can be so hard, but when you tap into the feels, so that brings you back to the why. So when you're doing this because you want to achieve your goal, you want to overcome a fear. So if you're afraid of Instagram reels like I am, you know, you can say to people like this is how to get started like you can take that tip and trick and relate it back to their emotions. Don't put the knife in. I've when I was a copywriter, I'd say does that mean? What's the knife in? So you want to exaggerate a bit like if you don't know what you're doing with Instagram reels and you feel dreadful and everyday you get on there and think today I'll do one and then you chickened out. And you know you're beating yourself up. You want to make it emotional. So that's what the knife is being put in life kick. I feel like a different term for that. It's very crappy. Like why are you doing that to people? Yeah, it's an analogy way sapping your own audience in the back. Yes, possibly not the best, no, might have to come up with a different term. I love that I got your interest. So like, Why? Why are you doing?

Suzanne Chadwick 38:35
But I think that that's a good little like equation as well is, you know, I want to have this goal. What's your thought leadership around it? Why, like, why does it matter? What's your opinion? And then this is how to do it. So you could kind of put those three things together as well. To like to connect with your audience a bit more.

Kate Merryweather 38:57
Yeah. So a lot of people might say like, if you do some research, your audience will say I tried this, but it didn't work. So then you can unpack that a bit. So you tried it and it didn't work? Well, what was it that didn't work? And that's where they have those they made mistakes they weren't aware of so you can enlighten them. So you might have five reasons why your whatever attempt didn't work. You didn't do this. You didn't do that. You didn't why your reels attempt didn't work. Because you only did it once and then you stopped doing exactly. You didn't make it easy and repurpose content. You did something that wasn't associated with your niche. Yeah, exactly. Oh, you know, everyone's doing this. Like dancing reels and stuff. That was a few years ago.

Suzanne Chadwick 39:43
Right. So you know, it's still a thing but you know, I don't think you have to do it. I do feel like totally This is a coaching call going going into a coaching call and having some real good for me. Yeah, it just started different. Yeah, I feel like it's becoming more quiet. Liddie focus rather than trend focused. So I feel like we were we've been through the whole trend thing. And I think that you can still use that like maybe you know, 30% of the time. But I feel like now people are really diving into and enjoying the, you know, face to camera, like actually giving writing content, which, you know, if you do do videos for YouTube, or LinkedIn or anywhere else, you can just repurpose it because, like, I love following people who give valuable content in reels now rather than just like trend stuff. So yeah, I'll just watch cat reels. That's all. I love it. That's good. Anything else that we need to do know be aware of when it comes to creating a message that hits our audience in the fields.

I think just be careful of what you assume about your audience. You assume your audience's feeling one way and they're not? You talking about a problem that you think they have. And that's not the actual problem. That can be very dangerous territory. So you're showing up, you're doing your reels, or you're on LinkedIn, or whatever, wherever you are. And that message isn't landing. And they'll move on so quickly. Like people's people are so fickle. Yeah. So fickle. Yeah. So can I miss, you know, we're in this potentially heading into a recession, people are really looking for problem solving. So I think tailoring your message to where people are at now, because things are different. And even a year ago, you know, like, people are really tightening their belts. So you might want to just tap into that and just check where people are at and talk talk to what's happening. At the moment, not just relying on research you did back in 2019. When we all bought courses for $2,000 and didn't do them then it was all no big deal. Now you may have tighten your belt a little bit. Yeah.

And I just and I was literally just about to say that's like you read my mind, is the relevancy? It's like, how can you take some of these, you know, I want to have this goal and what's happening in the market now or what's happening in the economy now or whatever it is, and and be really specific with it too. So that people like yeah, like, that's how I feel, because that's what's going on right now.

Kate Merryweather 42:29
And I think you can inspire people, like, the opposite of the knife is like the paint the picture, you can do this like you can, this is nicer. You can achieve, I can imagine what your life is like when you don't have this problem anymore. That can be really seductive. Paint that picture for them and get them excited about it, then it's much more likely that they'll take the next step, potentially, and you can convert them down the track because they're getting excited about life. What life could be like if they didn't have that problem.

Suzanne Chadwick 43:01
Yeah, and I call that the carrot and the stick. It's like a you. Are you with the knife banging me? Or are you got the carrot of imagined? Desire based? Yeah, I love that. And I think it's important to kind of maybe a little bit, a little bit of a little bit of both.

Kate Merryweather 43:19
All of this is about Inbound Marketing. You want to get people in the fields so that they're coming to you. And that is a lovely place to be in as a business owner to have people coming in saying, I like you, I follow you. I resonate with what you're saying. And I want to talk to you about how you can help me that is a lovely place to be in when I was a copywriter, I would get leads that were like, how much? Who are you? When can you do it? Do it. I'm talking to five other people. Why should I pick you. And that is not a nice, someone's offered $1,000 We do it for path. That is not a nice lead and a lead that comes in and says I love you. I love your writing. Please use somebody. That's a nice so all of this stuff. All of this messaging to get people in the field is to get them coming to you when they're ready with inbound marketing and attraction marketing. And they're warmed up. Because they already know what it's like to work with you they already know how you how you work. You've educated them.

Suzanne Chadwick 44:22
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And that's what we want. We want lovely kind cashed up. Lay ladies who are like I want whatever it is that you have. I love the messages. How can I work with you just to let me know all the ways. That's the message that you want. I have lots of money. Together. My problems Exactly.

Kate Merryweather 44:46
Yeah. And then then your challenge is to qualify them so that you're qualifying, qualifying and getting the best, the best potential clients that's a nice position to be instead of just taking whoever whoever's around. Whoever picks you You get to pick them. Yes, that's super nice.

Suzanne Chadwick 45:03
So go ahead and say okay for people who want to send you lovely cashed out messages on how to work together, where can they find you?

Kate Merryweather 45:12
Well, LinkedIn would be my preference. You can find me on Instagram. I am hopeless. But it's on my goal list. But it's always goes last but LinkedIn. Definitely. My name is Kate Murray weather search for me on LinkedIn. I have a website to Kate Murray weather.com. Today, you

Suzanne Chadwick 45:29
Yeah, we'll have all your links in the show notes as well. But for those who are walking the dog, or driving in the car, and they can they can quickly pull over, and then they find you and message you. Absolutely. Please do. Kate, thanks so much for sharing all your tips today. Thanks for having me. Have fun. Awesome. I loved that chat. Did you like it? Are you gonna start using all of those tips that Kate shared? I want to go that's the first one. The second one is I'm afraid of. And the third one is I don't know how to. So give those a try. Maybe tag K when you try them and and let us know how you go with them. But I think that there's some really useful things that you can use right now in your business. So I hope that you got a lot out of that. Well, that's it for another week. It has been amazing to have you here as always, and remember to follow me on all socials at Sue's Chadwick. But thanks so much for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, then I would love you to leave a review so that others can find the podcast and come and hang out with us every week. Until next time, have an awesome week and make sure you keep playing big and branding bold.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai